Okay the 540 is officialy driving me crazy.

[Spacey]

To get some help I feel that I need to provide some background info.

The 540 was the first trick that I truly wanted to land, so I started working on my tornados as soon as I started tricking, and for 3 months I tried to land the 540 without any luck, eventually another trickster taught the 540 through the Matt Emig way (just statically throwing the kicking knee over the other knee) and that way I learned a real crappy 540. This was after 3 months of tricking(06-october) now 6 months later (07-april) my 540 hasn't even improved very much. I am getting since I have now tricked for almost a year and the 540 is the only trick I can do and even it doesn't look good.

I couldn't find footage from my first 540 so this was the earliest footage I could provide from the 22th of February.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHLsRDzajdE

Now this is the 540 that I shot the 6th of april.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0l3S2SCHGc

[Swartz]

Yeah uh your post is only useful with a recent clip as well. So we're going to have to wait to help you. There's no point in anybody giving you tips on an old 540 of yours, but I already know people will come along without reading much and just say a bunch of crap anyway...

Also you just posted the clip so I realize I can't even see the old one at all right now anyway.

[Spacey]

Yeah uh your post is only useful with a recent clip as well. So we're going to have to wait to help you. There's no point in anybody giving you tips on an old 540 of yours, but I already know people will come along without reading much and just say a bunch of crap anyway...

Also you just posted the clip so I realize I can't even see the old one at all right now anyway.

I know but I will film my 540 first thing I do tommorow and then edit out the post.

[Swartz]

Should have waited mister.

[Spacey]

Should have waited mister.

Yeah, well I'll post it tommorow like I said.

[Spacey]

Okay here is a 540 that I shot today
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0l3S2SCHGc

[Augenatic]

Ouch, thats pretty ugleh', compared to your old 540. Practise the tornado, and then hyper it.

[Spacey]

Ouch, thats pretty ugleh', compared to your old 540. Practise the tornado, and then hyper it.
The thing is though that I have praticed my tornado so much already.. I dunno what I'm doing wrong because it feels like I'm not improving one bit.

[Source]

You need way more power and more extension on that kick. Seriously drill your tornadoes until your leg wants to fall off. Right now your just lifting your leg over the other one. It needs to be a kick that can take someone's head off.

[Filla_kick28]

Maybe trying stretching your leg a bit more, and when you 540 or tornado kick, try looking at that target on were you kicking, thats what i do and i find it helps alot, so maybe it will help you too:smile:

[Cicero]

I had a similar problem. I learned that focusing on keeping the kicking leg extended all the way through helped me tons.

[_blackened_]

Film your tornado for us :)

[Shikayo]

Hmm, I think that you aren't getting enough height, so you're rushing to land on your kicking leg, which is causing it to be bent.

Dig deeper, get down LOWER, bend those knees, then spring UP into the air.

Make sure that when you dig, your feet and therefore hips are facing in the opposite direction to where you want to kick.

Then, when you turn and jump up in the air to face your target, turn the hips to face the target too.

TURN THE HIPS! Open the hips!

And practise your inside crescent kicks as well, like others have said.

[Rayzer]

Don't haste that take-off!!! You twist so hard during those take-off steps that you can't get a bit of height and you're even moving forward in your 540 while you should be moving UP.

Think of this:

Relax

Hop-step

Dig down

PUNCH off the ground with all your force (jump UP)

Throw your arms UP (not around)

look to your "target" not to the ground

Throw your non kicking leg UP high and hard

Bring up your kicking leg and extend it

Turn over hips to land on you kicking leg

Be happy for landing a good 540:cool:


Good luck man! Sucks if you have so much trouble with a move, I have the same with backflips:smile:

[Swartz]

Wow your old 540 is slightly better, which is unusual. I mean it looks like you didn't practice it at all. Even short consistent practice would have improved the overall look of that. It seems you need to rotate around more to face your target which you set up to be the direction of the cam, but you end up kicking slightly on an angle in that direction.

Also, you need everything else. More power, speed, extension, height.

Go back to your tornadoes, I mean that's what you were doing there anyway and they were sloppy. Just drill them.

You're not ready for 540s yet. I'm going to state that blunty and honestly. Drill drill drill those tornadoes. Work on your basics crescent and roundhouse kicks, stretching, etc.

I still find it hard to believe you actually practiced this move enough to be at this stage after a year. When I started I had no real physical abilities, no prior experience to anything, poor flexbility, strength and all that, but I practiced consistently and it came along. Tornadoes fairly quickly. Obviously the 540 took a bit longer. Around a year or so, haha. Though I hadn't practiced the 540 specifically that long. I would have had it sooner if I had.

I know everyone learns at a different rate but...I can't understand your situation. Even if you did try this consistently you just went at it doing it the same way everytime without trying different methods to improve. That's what I see here.

[Spacey]

Well this attempt was really really lousy, I am not that bad Swartz, and I haven't tricked for a year yet.

Listen I'll film one more with more power, extension etc and you'll see that it isn't that bad. This one was truly worse than I usually do.

Give me another chance here before you completely rain my parade.

[Johnny_Angel]

Try your other leg. Maybe you'll be pleasantly surprised.

[Kage]

Go back to drilling tornados imo. theres too many things to fix here. biggest problem is that you're not even kicking the way you were originally facing, meaning that your hips are locking up at some point and not bringing you around.

Restricting hip movement is going to kill your extension and power anyway so dont bother working on those. go back to tornados and make sure that you bring your kick all the way around. a good idea might be to focus on an imaginary/visual point and try to kick it.

Oh and that's another point. Your leg is kinda just lifting with no real intention to kick. If you want a nice 540 you gotta trick to kill >=) Good luck with the move though :good:

[Birch]

'rain my parade' whats an emo kid like you doin on a physical excercise related site like this?

[Augenatic]

Spacey, I've seen your oldest 540, it was much better than the new ones.

[Spacey]

Kage: I've already worked so much with the tornado I doubt it will really help me that much.

Anyhow I decided to record a new 540 today, the one I did yesterday was below even my average so this is more true to the one that I usually do at least.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kc4zeFLwXFc

[Shikayo]

That's looking much better.

All I can say is dip down lower: the axis at which you dig down into the ground is the axis you'll spin on when you jump and turn to kick. Therefore, the lower you dip the more of a lean back you'll have when you go to kick, giving you more height. Something along those lines anyway.

[Augenatic]

That's allright, but you gotta kick and hyper it, instead of making it kinda... forced...

[JiayoJames]

Hey man that is awesome if I could 540 like that I would be so pleased... you are like a super good tricker.

[Spacey]

Hey man that is awesome if I could 540 like that I would be so pleased... you are like a super good tricker.

lol stop it James, you have a way better 540 than me :tongue:

[RandyMintz]

if you drilled tornado kicks everyday within those months, you would have a ben brown like 540, but it doesnt look like you have any of the basic fundamental down, therefore if you simply practice bad 540s you will get really good at doing bad 540s

[Swartz]

Yeah I agree, while that last clip is better it's extremely low and forced, still bent, and you don't even chamber the kick. Really now, just practice your tornadoes a bunch, and if you're going to show us anything, show us those. That doesn't mean go film them for us right now. Honestly I'd say keep the camera as reference for yourself, don't post up clips for a while and just drill tornado kicks A LOT.

[Spacey]

Yeah I agree, while that last clip is better it's extremely low and forced, still bent, and you don't even chamber the kick. Really now, just practice your tornadoes a bunch, and if you're going to show us anything, show us those. That doesn't mean go film them for us right now. Honestly I'd say keep the camera as reference for yourself, don't post up clips for a while and just drill tornado kicks A LOT.

Yeah but it just feels like I'm running out of time. In a couple of months I will have tricked a year and I want to have some progress by that time to show up with at least.

But fine I'll try to pratice the tornados for awhile see if it improves anything.

[Shikayo]

Yeah but it just feels like I'm running out of time. In a couple of months I will have tricked a year and I want to have some progress by that time to show up with at least.

I understand what you mean, and you do have progress: you have a 540. It might not be the best 540, but you do have a 540 which is more than many people can say (I couldn't say it until two days ago).

Don't rush the perfection part of tricking - take your time to disect the move and improve certain aspects slowly. If you rush, you wont develop a healthier looking 540. But still, a couple of months is plenty of time: if you practise it several times a week, all you can do is go up and get better.

[TKD_Andy]

if you drilled tornado kicks everyday within those months, you would have a ben brown like 540

this is just plain wrong.

[Rayzer]

Tricking is supposed to be fun to do, but to me it seems you're not enjoying it at all. You almost see it like work, at least that's how I interpret the things you wrote here.

You do not have to practise only one move at a time. It is bad to train for too many moves at the same time, but 1-3 moves is good. So apart from your tornado/540's, practise some other moves. You may turn out to be a natural flipper/twister/"aerial-er".

Try to get the fun factor back, cause in the end that's what tricking is about!:cool:

[Zenrenn]

Take a look at Juji's 540 tutorial, not the video. Look for the part where he talks about an indian man in his bed, he talks about his foot being in an odd place which might help you. I'm basically pointing this out because I don't think many people catch it, but either way just listen to the former people and have fun. I myself haven't gotten it yet either.

[Swartz]

Yeah but it just feels like I'm running out of time. In a couple of months I will have tricked a year and I want to have some progress by that time to show up with at least.

But fine I'll try to pratice the tornados for awhile see if it improves anything.

Your problem pal is that you're wanting this andthat in a certain amount of time. You're trying to progress as fast as possible and not spending enough time on actually progressing with the basics and drilling moves down before trying to advance all over the place. Quit being impatient and have fun with the challenge of learning all this. Don't worry about how fast anybody else is going or even yourself. Just focus on doing better gradually. Who cares if it's been a year and you can't do much? You know what I could do after my first year? Like a kip up, bkick, tornado and 360 crescent, one hand cartwheels, I think a backlip by the end of the 1 year mark, and that was it. I mean, that's not very impressive for a year is it? Well it's because my way of training and my mindset was fucked up. In a little different way than yours but it wasn't until I changed my habits that I started progressing. That's just one part of it though. Everyone progresses differently so even if you're using some good training methods you just aren't going to be as good as everyone else, and some people are going to be worse off than you.

Have fun but don't just rush it. Landing crappy tricks all your life isn't going to satisfy you as much as landing nicely done tricks will. Nicely done reflects your passion for doing things well, and makes actually performing them that much easier and second nature for you.

[Spacey]

Thanks for all the tips guys, I just took a little break from tricking and then tried to do my 540 again. Here are the results, I at least think it looks better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3-ccopCESg

[adolescent moron]

lols thats a load better anywayz but who teh hell was ur camera man?

[Swartz]

Yeah that sideways crap is annoying. It's slightly better dude but once agian you've filmed 3 back to back clips in a matter or a week or two. Tricks take longer that to improve, at least most, especially kicks though. Those don't turn out nice overnight, they're very gradual as you develop more strength and flexibility. Keep working on it. Don't be afraid to work both the tornado and 540 though. You need to get your basics strong while working on an advanced move like the 540. By advanced I mean compared to the tornado kick of course. Warm up and drill tornadoes if you plan on practicing 540s in your trick session, and finish with the 540s themselves. Just be patient and have fun. Like I said, I wouldn't keep adding a new clip every few days like you're still doing. Just stop depending on this forum and advice as a crutch and go out and train some more. Get away from here for a while and just focus on your tricking out there where you're free from distractions. Then return with new clips or whatever in a month or a few months. Seriously. I highly suggest it, both because it's annoying to see all the time here and it'll only help you learn.

[Bunghole]

dude dw about it my 540 looked like that untill i stretched a bit, and also, you need to really drive your non kicking leg up like you would in a gainer, and do the kick over it

[k-slash]

Dude can you film your tornado kick and post it ?

Cause I seriously think it`s the rute of your problem here.
Right now your not even kicking in2 the tornado kick before you hyper it, thats why your kick looks like that + your taking away all the power that the tornado set-up should give to you in order for you to 540 kick properly.
I`m going out in about an hour so I`ll film a tornado kick and a 540 kick and I`ll see if I can help you out abit with this.

[TommyGun]

join the club

[TommyGun]

ive been drilling tornados for roughly 3 months aswell.

all that is improving are my tornado kicks and not my 540.

[TKD_Andy]

haha no shit...

this is what people just DONT get!

DRILLING TORNADOS DOESNT GIVE YOU A 1337 540!! DRILLING 540S GIVES YOU A 1337 540!!

[mchitti]

My current 540 looks worse than you first post new 540, which is hella bad.

[Augenatic]

haha no shit...

this is what people just DONT get!

DRILLING TORNADOS DOESNT GIVE YOU A 1337 540!! DRILLING 540S GIVES YOU A 1337 540!!

Haha. Ye, tornados lead up to 540's..

[TKD_Andy]

*slaps head*

man... there needs to be some kinda chalkboard function where you can explain things in the simplest possible terms so people can understand...

[TommyGun]

a funny thing happened once. i almost had a 540, but i landed and my feet slipped out from under me, causing me to land on my face.

haha good times

[Dark Twista]

Shut up tommygun

[TommyGun]

No, you shut up!





*sulks*

[Swartz]

a funny thing happened once. i almost had a 540, but i landed and my feet slipped out from under me, causing me to land on my face.

haha good times

As much as you're disliked, I have to agree that I've done the exact same thing (after having learned it already though) several times. I have to be careful actually with 540s, otherwise I end up overdoing it a bit much.

[adolescent moron]

540s aren't that hard i got it in a month yet its one of the only 3 tricks i know


dude... don't try to 540 just do the tornado kick until u die never try to 540 or it wont work...check jujis tutorial its says there not to try to do it....

[adolescent moron]

"First, if you are trying to simply land on the kicking leg, you were never trying the move correctly to begin with."-juji

i dont wanna sound like im naggin but thats exactly what ur doing don't try to land on the kicking leg just drill the tornado kick and 540s come so naturally.

[TommyGun]

but doing the same move over is boring...

thats why im drilling tornados and bkicks =P

[taichichuan]

Hmmm.. I recently nailed my 540 kick.. And I only did a few tornado kicks... . only advice I can give, And that is takeoff... My kicks are good but not that good:p. But as soon as i got the power in my takeoff, my legs went up, my arms went UP. and my kicking leg went straight over. Takeoff is the key. Also try going more horizontal. Its probs not the best thing to do, But gradually go back further till the kick comes round with power. I find the more horizontal you plan on going the more powerful the takeoff.
but honostly im not no where near as good as some of the guys you see. and im relativly new. BUT takeoff is everything in 540 kick

[Swartz]

540s aren't that hard i got it in a month yet its one of the only 3 tricks i know

540s, while being one of the basic tricks may not be hard to learn for everybody but if you told me it was easy to do well I'd have to slap you. It takes A LOT of work to have a nice clean 540. Just being able to do one is on a completely different level, and those 540s tend to be sloppy.

Kicks, such as the 540 are quite underrated.

[shengoikee]

yeah being able to land completely upright or gyro isnt that common

[Spacey]

I know I'm not supposed to post this early but I wanted to tell you Swartz that I took your advice, since monday I have been having an everday 30 min session, consisting of 15min tornado kicks and 15min 540. Except for thuesday and wednesday when I was hurt so basically I've been praticing twice at least.

Anyhow I want to know if my 540 has improved now since the first video here is a 540 I shot today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c482hWBuTvs

[Ultima]

from the one video I saw of ur 540..

It would seem that you do a few things quite wrong

1) the setup pre spin thing ( before you actually jump) has to be much much quicker .. rotate with the balls of your feet ... and make more use of your arms

2) the non kicking leg gets up waaaay to early.. give urself a tad more stall on that bit .. throw that non kicking leg up ( as if you where doing a outside cresent kick ) then wip it in quickly to your butt as you kick with the other leg

3) cock in the kicking leg first , then extend it out with a snap like all kicks should be.. kick nice and high like you kickig some ones head off..
work at aiming at kicking something.. like an Imaginary spot..

4) WRAP your arms in to creat a fast twist .. some ppl dont do this.. some dont have to :) but if you do.. it makes ur spins go insanely fast!!!!!!!!!

thats about all I can say

[Ultima]

that latest 540 video was a lot better however ... try use the tips I gave you to try and improove even more .. basically this whole move is basically in the setup .. and how quickly you can do that setup which gives you the momentum to do the move.. yes the kick also gives momentum.. but a fast setup helps alot!

[biyak]

this is just plain wrong.
*slaps head*

man... there needs to be some kinda chalkboard function where you can explain things in the simplest possible terms so people can understand...

hahhahahahhaha

train tornado <> 540
train 540 = good 540 lol

but andy you are a little wrong because his 540 is just pretty awful X__X
he needs to train his tornado ( to get the setup correct and the kick) then when
he is able to do a 540 ( well normal one ) then he needs to train it like a crazyassman!

but yea training tornado's for years wont give you ben browns 540....

what that dud needs to do is train his setup
his setup is shit plain and simple... look at andy tut, juji's chose the one you like train it so it will actually give you momentum and not drill you to the ground
and then train those 540!!!
^^

[Swartz]

I know I'm not supposed to post this early but I wanted to tell you Swartz that I took your advice, since monday I have been having an everday 30 min session, consisting of 15min tornado kicks and 15min 540. Except for thuesday and wednesday when I was hurt so basically I've been praticing twice at least.

Anyhow I want to know if my 540 has improved now since the first video here is a 540 I shot today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c482hWBuTvs

Yeah that's a little better. I mean you're kicking well enough that you don't really have to devote half your session to tornado kicks. Just do them as warm up now, to get yourself ready physically and mentally for the 540. Then just spend most of your time drilling the 540 itself. I mean having a good tornado kick helps your 540 but you can't expect to clean up your 540 just doing tornado kicks either, so yeah that's what I'd recommend at this point. Warmup with tornadoes, maybe just a few, then drill that 540 a lot.

It'll grow very gradually on you. You'll notice more speed power and height develop over time. Your landings will be a little smoother and it'll overall just look less struggled.


That's the conditioning part.

Next I'll discuss something to change in your technique:


You're bringing your leg up bent but I can tell it's not to chamber, because you don't actually straighten it out in the move. You're still dragging it through slightly bent. I guarantee it's not some flexibility issue either, you just are focused on bringing it up straight so you dont' really think about how bent or straight the leg is. You're just wanting to get it around and land it.

Instead, DO THIS: When you bring up your kicking leg, bring it up bent, and when you're about to hit your imaginary target in front of you up high, STRAIGHTEN it out. I mean you should definetly see and feel yourself doing it. You'll notice the difference right away. I mean it should be straight up until you land at which point you'll bent it SLIGHTLY to absorb the landing since you don't want to land with your knee locked...obviously.

Really work on the chamber and release. Bent, then straight.

Also, if you want to do more with your nonkicking leg, and this'll help your height and look of the 540 as a whole. Do the completely opposite with your nonkicking leg as you do with your kicking leg. Bring it up straight, then bend it.

So as you're brining up your nonkicking leg straight, you're brining up your kicking leg bent, and as you straighten out and kick with your kicking leg, you're bending your nonkicking leg in, like you want to hit your butt with the heel of the foot.

They just ALTERNATE. Concentrate on that technique each time you try one and if you keep drilling it that way, you'll not only get the technique down second nature but you'll be developing the strength and conditioning necessary to make your 540 really good.

Keep it up.

I may have been a bit repetitive in this post but I think if you read it through you'll understand it well enough, and I really wanted to get my point across as best as I could. Drill it into your head so you don't forget haha.

[skullmyst]

i would say if you're having that much trouble (although the last one was ALOT better) to try changing the type of kick that you're doing. I recently changed from doing a crescent tornado (upright) to a layback round kick, and im getting ALOT closer. I'm actually closer to a super-layback 540 than an upright one lol. The round kick just seems to be easier to drive under you to land that 540.

[Spacey]

Yeah that's a little better. I mean you're kicking well enough that you don't really have to devote half your session to tornado kicks. Just do them as warm up now, to get yourself ready physically and mentally for the 540. Then just spend most of your time drilling the 540 itself. I mean having a good tornado kick helps your 540 but you can't expect to clean up your 540 just doing tornado kicks either, so yeah that's what I'd recommend at this point. Warmup with tornadoes, maybe just a few, then drill that 540 a lot.

It'll grow very gradually on you. You'll notice more speed power and height develop over time. Your landings will be a little smoother and it'll overall just look less struggled.


That's the conditioning part
Next I'll discuss something to change in your technique:


You're bringing your leg up bent but I can tell it's not to chamber, because you don't actually straighten it out in the move. You're still dragging it through slightly bent. I guarantee it's not some flexibility issue either, you just are focused on bringing it up straight so you dont' really think about how bent or straight the leg is. You're just wanting to get it around and land it.

Instead, DO THIS: When you bring up your kicking leg, bring it up bent, and when you're about to hit your imaginary target in front of you up high, STRAIGHTEN it out. I mean you should definetly see and feel yourself doing it. You'll notice the difference right away. I mean it should be straight up until you land at which point you'll bent it SLIGHTLY to absorb the landing since you don't want to land with your knee locked...obviously.

Really work on the chamber and release. Bent, then straight.

Also, if you want to do more with your nonkicking leg, and this'll help your height and look of the 540 as a whole. Do the completely opposite with your nonkicking leg as you do with your kicking leg. Bring it up straight, then bend it.

So as you're brining up your nonkicking leg straight, you're brining up your kicking leg bent, and as you straighten out and kick with your kicking leg, you're bending your nonkicking leg in, like you want to hit your butt with the heel of the foot.

They just ALTERNATE. Concentrate on that technique each time you try one and if you keep drilling it that way, you'll not only get the technique down second nature but you'll be developing the strength and conditioning necessary to make your 540 really good.

Keep it up.

I may have been a bit repetitive in this post but I think if you read it through you'll understand it well enough, and I really wanted to get my point across as best as I could. Drill it into your head so you don't forget haha.

That's not very repetetive at all Swartz that's very very helpful actually! You've helped me alot with this move and I can only say that I am very grateful for that.

I'll condition as you said with less focus on tornadoes and then spending more time on the session with the actual 540.

And I know that the chamber still needs to improve, and I'm trying to work on it as good as I can but I'll take your tip and try to make it even more bent in the takeoff and kick of more.

About the other leg, somehow I have some real hard issues having a straight non-kicking leg in the takeoff of the 540, but I'll try working on that and see if it helps, since alot of people say it might.

Again, thanks for all the help Swartz.

[Ultima]

Ah i basically said the exact same damn thing as swartz cept I did not elborate as much .. any case swartz has given you damn good advise best u follow it

[Swartz]

About the other leg, somehow I have some real hard issues having a straight non-kicking leg in the takeoff of the 540, but I'll try working on that and see if it helps, since alot of people say it might.

Oh yeah it's not easy. I find it hard to lift that first leg up really high straight. I mean I'll get it up to around parallel with the floor usually but that's it. It's just awkward raising it up straight and high like that from such a position. You'll get better at it though. I don't do it all the time anymore because I'm very comfortable with the move so I can do it either way but I tend to like the look of my 540s more when I do it that way.