Bulky

[Fin]

Right I just finished cutting! So weight's are going up! Protien levels are going up! My clean snatch is going up! and hopefully I'll have a good body by the end of it.

wish me luck my first session is tommorow, and is anyone else bulking at the moment?

[Honken]

Coincidentally, my bulk also starts tommorow.

[Fin]

thats the spirit... peak in summer ftw!!!!!

[anfeyd]

Why are you bulking straight out of a cut?

[Rahf]

I've been on a bulk since the beginning of January and will keep on going through summer.

[Fanya]

Until I reach 180 or get tired of eating, whichever comes first.

[Kibs]

I'm starting my cut Monday.

[chicanerous]

Coincidently I never cut.

[Rahf]

15 year olds should never cut. You should focus on doing what you always do.. Wanking, chasing girls, living life and whatnot. Unless you're obese that is.

[mr popular]

I am bulking. I will not cut until I am between 200 and 210lbs. Currently I am at around 175.

[Swartz]

Haha I think once I start taking the whole bulking seriously I won't cut until like a few years later. This whole cutting this is hilarious. More people are concerned about than they should be I think.

[rock_ten]

Swartz, some people never do have to cut - they simply won't put fat on. You see a lot of people like that on BB.com with their progress pictures. The more they eat, the more muscle they gain. Never is significant fat gained.

Many people gain fat readily, and therefore do have to cut, lest they become seriously fat shits.

[Rahf]

Depends if you're meso-, ecto- or endomorph. Bodybuilders on various drugs aren't really a good example. Also the BB.com people use 10 different supplements! They make ALL the difference! /ironic comment

[rock_ten]

Also the BB.com people use 10 different supplements! They make ALL the difference! /ironic comment

The number of different supplements one uses doesn't imply anything about their success.

even if they were valid and well-chosen supplements, they aren't going to be responsible for the effect I mentioned. That's entirely down to 'genetics'.

[Rahf]

The number of different supplements one uses doesn't imply anything about their success.

even if they were valid and well-chosen supplements, they aren't going to be responsible for the effect I mentioned. That's entirely down to 'genetics'.

Obviously you didn't read the whole of my post.

[Karlnold]

The number of different supplements one uses doesn't imply anything about their success.

even if they were valid and well-chosen supplements, they aren't going to be responsible for the effect I mentioned. That's entirely down to 'genetics'.

Changing/increasing your whole metabolism and anabolism with various anabolic-steroids WILL affect the outcome and results compared to if you were natural... We don't expect much from you nowdays but you should know about this atleast...

[AJCN]

bulk then cut, bulk then cut.

[rock_ten]

Changing/increasing your whole metabolism and anabolism with various anabolic-steroids WILL affect the outcome and results compared to if you were natural... We don't expect much from you nowdays but you should know about this atleast...

we tend to differentiate between "supplements" and "drugs", although the boundary is perhaps unclear. Steroids, at least, are generally in the latter category. Since Rahf said "supplements", it makes sense that I acknowledged that and didn't interchange the phrase with something else

----

Steroids are valid

[Karlnold]

Yes, because we all know that the guys at BB.com only uses "supplements"...

[rock_ten]

Yes, because we all know that the guys at BB.com only uses "supplements"...

Some people at BB.com use "supplements", some also use "drugs" (steroids).. you'd be wrong to generalise that they don't juice.

[Karlnold]

"juice"!

[NightHunter]

I "too" enjoy putting "quotes" around "words."

[mr popular]

rock_ten you fucking idiot, why would someone take an "after" picture mid-program to show their progress!?

the BB.com progress pictures (of people who actually want to gain muscle), are progress pictures of people who start off skinny, then (typically) bulk up, and then lose fat before taking "after" pictures.

Otherwise, many of them also do cardio while bulking to keep fat from getting out of hand. From what I've observed in general the people that do this have less developed legs--just an observation, I don't think it's a bad idea at all.

And also... the whole ecto-, meso-, whatever whatever YEAH YEAH it's bullshit. Okay, so you can classify the general way a person sort of looks when they are untrained. Great. That says nothing about their hormone profile, their nutrient response, muscle-building genetics, etc.etc...... There are better ways for measuring someone's genetic potential for bodybuilding.

[Rahf]

rock_ten you fucking idiot, why would someone take an "after" picture mid-program to show their progress!?

the BB.com progress pictures (of people who actually want to gain muscle), are progress pictures of people who start off skinny, then (typically) bulk up, and then lose fat before taking "after" pictures.

Otherwise, many of them also do cardio while bulking to keep fat from getting out of hand. From what I've observed in general the people that do this have less developed legs--just an observation, I don't think it's a bad idea at all.

And also... the whole ecto-, meso-, whatever whatever YEAH YEAH it's bullshit. Okay, so you can classify the general way a person sort of looks when they are untrained. Great. That says nothing about their hormone profile, their nutrient response, muscle-building genetics, etc.etc...... There are better ways for measuring someone's genetic potential for bodybuilding.

Bolded part, it still does not add up if you are on a energy plus. The amount of extra calories, genetics and resistance training are the ones that ultimately determine fat gain.

[mr popular]

Well if they know what they are doing they obviously manipulate their calories accordingly. haha

And it would make a slight difference. Particularly if they do like MANY bodybuilders do, and do 20-45minutes of light cardio after each weighttraining session. Keeping up with some light cardio while bulking also helps a bit with calorie partitioning in the body.

So it's not a bad idea, but i personally wouldn't run because I would fear the same thing would happen to my legs. But if I had access to a pool, or something else... I dunno... we shall see in the future.

[anfeyd]

Well if they know what they are doing they obviously manipulate their calories accordingly. haha

And it would make a slight difference. Particularly if they do like MANY bodybuilders do, and do 20-45minutes of light cardio after each weighttraining session. Keeping up with some light cardio while bulking also helps a bit with calorie partitioning in the body.

So it's not a bad idea, but i personally wouldn't run because I would fear the same thing would happen to my legs. But if I had access to a pool, or something else... I dunno... we shall see in the future.

Smaller legs could be due to less volume compared to the rest of the body volume (from what i've seen, a lot favor upper body volume). For instance, Antoine did the cardio that you described and his legs are not small.

I am aware that this is just one instance, but as you always tell others on the board- try it for yourself and see what happens. Surely you would be able to tell if your legs were getting smaller before they became sticks.

[Swartz]

Swartz, some people never do have to cut - they simply won't put fat on. You see a lot of people like that on BB.com with their progress pictures. The more they eat, the more muscle they gain. Never is significant fat gained.

Many people gain fat readily, and therefore do have to cut, lest they become seriously fat shits.
Yeah thanks for clarifying my point genius.

[Fanya]

How about we stop turning this into something akin the MA subforum.

[rock_ten]

genius.

Thanks.

I think once I start taking the whole bulking seriously I won't cut until like a few years later. This whole cutting this is hilarious. More people are concerned about than they should be I think.

It looked like you were questioning the neccessity of cutting, apparently unaware that most people are unlike yourself in that they do readily gain fat, and need to cut.

------

the BB.com progress pictures (of people who actually want to gain muscle), are progress pictures of people who start off skinny, then (typically) bulk up, and then lose fat before taking "after" pictures.


which BB.com progress pictures? Not the ones I'm talking about, anyway. You definately find plenty of people on there who say that they never cut, or are "forever bulking!" etc, who stay extremely lean constantly and never gain fat.

---

I think a good way to picture it is how wide their tolerance zone of calories is, or a "buffer", something like that. The narrower the point at which you switch between losing and gaining fat, the more difficult it is to balance it, and the more fat you likely gain while eat hypercalorically. Maybe some always-ripped dude can eat 3000-4000 calories which is sufficient for muscle growth, but in him will not promote net fat gain. While another person has to eat 3000 calories to gain muscle but by that point fat gain is already operating too.

There's countless points of regulation at which individual differences, "genetics", could have an effect. I expect a very large contribution is by insulin sensitivity. Insulin is horrendously anabolic, to most tissues (including muscle and fat).. muscle insulin sensitivity varies considerably according to your lifestyle (and between individuals), while that of adipose tissue varies less at least according to lifestyle factors..

That's just one point that variation must occur, but I expect quite an important one.

[mr popular]

Well, would you like to provide links to these progress pictures so that we can see them?

I'm sure we'd be better off reading them and learning from what they've actually done

[rock_ten]

Well, would you like to provide links to these progress pictures so that we can see them?

I'm sure we'd be better off reading them and learning from what they've actually done

I have no links and certainly aren't going to look for any. I'm just saying what I've seen during my time around fitness forums, and in real life. It isn't based on hard data or anything.

-------

Are you actually contending anything I have said?

Is it your position that people who "never gain fat" are in that state because of voluntary lifestyle factors that we could apply to other people and see the same condition arise?

[mr popular]

Most people you will see that are lean and muscular got that way through hard work in both their training and their diet.

Link: http://www.teenbodybuilding.com/jazc.htm

^^ that is a good example of someone who is pretty lucky in terms of genetics. He is very muscular, and on a sidenote.. he apparently lifts heavy all of time, even while prepping for a contest.

He is very strict with his diet, and does cardio everyday.

Some people are genetically gifted to be lean, and stay lean, but in my personal experience those people don't make as much progress in the long-term as others do.

A good example is someone like JoeSchmo from the bodybuilding.com forums.

Link: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=659148

His body is pretty incredible, and I do look up to the guy as having achieved something I would love to achieve.. But from year to year, he doesn't seem to make a whole lot of progress (as compared to how much he potentially could be making). Still, not the best example, because I think he actually does things very well overall. And also, it's not like he is just some lazy slob that does nothing and looks like that... he weightlifts with lots of dedication, he plays football, and runs track.. and he is also dedicated to his nutrition.

So yeah basically rock_ten you are full of shit as usual....

[Gazapo]

rock_ten is a troll. That being said, I don't cut. Just keep a clean diet.

[rock_ten]

So yeah basically rock_ten you are full of shit as usual....

dude, you are not disagreeing with me at all. What am I saying that is full of shit?

rock_ten is a troll

LOL yea, good stuff.

I think that perhaps I should write like a retard - would that stop you assuming I'm trolling? Actually, I guess its just tradition. But its a bit of a shame - I actually think I contribute to the forum significantly, and try to promote clear and meaningful discussion - something that isn't tolerated by most members. Does anyone actually read my posts any more or just notice "rock_ten" and write a reply saying how much shit I'm talking?

[Ashtar]

Going on a bulking diet is the most effiecient way of building muscle, but RT's right that some guys don't do bulking/cutting cycles, they might eat more or less on and off but overall gain muscle with little fat. Possibly they migh have gained more on a managed bulk, but point is they progress. If you can do that without gaining fat it's good.

[mr popular]

That seems to be what Juji prefers doing.

I don't think anybody ever said it was impossible to never gain fat and still make progress haha

Thing is... if you look at someone like JoeSchmo and had no knowledge about him, you'd assume that he gains 10lbs of muscle each year simply because he's a genetic freak. Now this isn't to say he is not genetically gifted, but that doesn't downplay the fact he weightlifts hard and heavy, is an accomplished athlete, and has a very strict diet--and also, sets solid goals for himself to reach.

Find me one person who trains and eats like complete shit, and yet makes progress in muscular gains as fast, or faster, than a person who trains and eats right (even if that person trains and eats in such a way so as to slow down their progress to keep their bodyfat % under a certain level)

see what i'm saying buddy buddy?

[Fanya]

rock_ten, we ignore you and/or pass off what you say as shit because you lie extravagantly about everything you do, and what little sense you do make is meaningless among the sea of crap that you spew