Alternative to Isometric part II

[30something]

About 6 weeks ago I posted about a program I started called Elastic Steel.

Of course because I was saying something different and because this is mostly a "kiddie" forum some immature ones tried to clown me etc. etc.
Others called me a sales rep for the company because I was talking about a program that Kurz didn't invent.

Anyway I have to admit I have seen good improvement.
6 weeks ago I was at 15 inches from the ground now I am down to 7 inches on my side and front splits.

Any program takes time and make sure you are breathing correctly.
I will post another update later.

[shengoikee]

.ok.

[dec]

glad to hear your progressing mate, being stretching myself for the last 8months using the kurz method, took a while in the begining but making progress now,im about 8inchs from the floor in front and sides,will look up the method your talking about

[30something]

dec,
what was your starting point?
mine was originally 18 inches before I tried stretching at all about 6 months ago.

[short gorilla]

I would honestly not berate you but the only time I see you posting is when you pop in to mention Elastic Steel. Yeah, it's a good program. So is Kurz's stuff. So is Juji's program. If you stretch using any program regularly you will make improvements. Do you trick? Why are you bothering to post this if you take no interest in the forum? Hope I'm not clowning you too much.

[30something]

All good points...
The reason I don't post more about tricking is because I don't trick as much as I stretch.
Being at my ripe old age I am really focusing more on stretching and once I get more flexible and less tight in my muscles & tendons I will attempt more tricks and my stretching excercises will be less demanding.

Right now I can more gymnastic types of tricks:
handspring
cartwheel
almost landed a back tuck a few times on a mattress.

In a few months my flexibility should be better and I will feel more comfortable attempting the tricks that seem to require more flexibility.

[Sleepy]

If it's an immature "kiddie" forum then fuck off, you're old.

[30something]

I said mostly - you must be in the majority lol

[Sleepy]

LOL! witty! actually, i just hate people who whinge. you fit nicely into that catagory.

[chicanerous]

All good points...
The reason I don't post more about tricking is because I don't trick as much as I stretch.
Being at my ripe old age I am really focusing more on stretching and once I get more flexible and less tight in my muscles & tendons I will attempt more tricks and my stretching excercises will be less demanding..

This is unrelated, but do you strength train? In your ripe old age, quantity and preservation of muscle mass will be important in improving the quality of the end of your life. If you haven't started yet, you should get going, as your hormone levels are only going to continue to decline as you age.

In addition, cardiovascular fitness is important, especially having a higher VO2 and maintaining it through regular conditioning, as this is correlated to faster recovery from both injuries and disease.

In the scheme of things, flexibility is a relatively low priority.

[short gorilla]

In the scheme of things, flexibility is a relatively low priority.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/th3n00b/family-guy-i-disagree-1.jpg

[chicanerous]

I disagree.
The scheme of things: staying alive and functioning in old age. For that, anything beyond the ROM needed for daily activities is superfluous.

Anyways, that's beside the point currently, as he is only 30 and this thread is about his progress on Elastic Steel.

[short gorilla]

The scheme of things: staying alive and functioning in old age. For that, anything beyond the ROM needed for daily activities is superfluous.

Anyways, that's beside the point currently, as he is only 30 and this thread is about his progress on Elastic Steel.

Yeah, it's getting off-topic, but still. I've worked with a lot of geriatrics, and if they don't stretch, they don't even retain normal ROM. Being more flexible comes in handy with a lot of things, and it can help prevent injuries. I'm NOT saying stretching prevents injuries. But being more flexible does. For instance: ever slip and fall, say on the ice, splitting your legs? I have. Never hurt myself doing it either.

People who lift weights need flexibility too. I've seen cases where people doing a lot of heavy lifting lost ROM, and in one instance a guy split a tendon and some muscle tissue in his arm while doing chinups. His bicep and tendons balled up by his shoulder.

Try doing a deadlift with inflexible hamstrings/lower back. Enjoy your injuries.

This isn't to detract from your points that strength and cardiovascular fitness are important, because you're right, they are important. But you can't neglect flexibility. It even helps with the recovery process.

I'm not going to push this any farther than that. So agree, disagree, whatever.

[30something]

I was sort of being facetious about the whole old age thing...

But I do strength train also but just using body weight exercises.

[shengoikee]

i'm still sceptical about your reasons for being here

[dec]

30something,
i was about the 19-20inch mark, had both front and box splits at 10yrs old, but i played alot of football and stuff after that til i was 19 and for some reason i lost them, it took me just over 2years to get them when i was 10 so im not naturally flexible but now after nearly a year im getting close again, i wont loose them this time round:smile:,

[short gorilla]

I was sort of being facetious about the whole old age thing...

But I do strength train also but just using body weight exercises.

Yeah I was directing my last statement to Chicanerous.

[chicanerous]

Yeah, it's getting off-topic, but still. I've worked with a lot of geriatrics, and if they don't stretch, they don't even retain normal ROM. Being more flexible comes in handy with a lot of things, and it can help prevent injuries. I'm NOT saying stretching prevents injuries. But being more flexible does. For instance: ever slip and fall, say on the ice, splitting your legs? I have. Never hurt myself doing it either.
Do these geriatrics participate in a weight-training or resistance training routine though? That's what I'm talking about -- if you participate in a well-rounded weight-training routine and don't stunt your ROM, you'll retain suitable flexibility for daily activity.

Slipping and falling on the ice into a split is hardly a justification for a need to be able to do the splits.

If you're obliquely referring to "those people" who always seem to be pulling muscles in the groin or where-have-you, it's more likely that they lack strength in key muscles. Weak adductors, for example, are the #1 contributing factor to groin pulls.

People who lift weights need flexibility too. I've seen cases where people doing a lot of heavy lifting lost ROM, and in one instance a guy split a tendon and some muscle tissue in his arm while doing chinups. His bicep and tendons balled up by his shoulder.
In either case, the problem is not that the guys didn't stretch, but rather that they didn't program their routine correctly. As well, in the case of the first guy, you say he lost ROM. What ROM? He certainly didn't lose the ROM he used daily to perform his exercises. If he had a superfluous ROM and he lost it, who cares? By definition, he wasn't using it so it's not needed. In the case of the second guy, the split tendon is going to be due to a combination of factors. Using a full ROM when he does chin-ups and curls and minding the strength of his triceps as compared to his biceps would have done a lot to prevent it -- no "stretching" needed. An improper warm-up could also have been a factor, especially if he wasn't particularly strong relative to his bodyweight on the movement.

Try doing a deadlift with inflexible hamstrings/lower back. Enjoy your injuries.
If you're not flexible enough to perform a movement, yes, you need to stretch, but I've been talking about the maintenance of flexibility. Once you have sufficient flexibility, exercising with the full ROM will be enough to maintain it. Stretching, in the conventional sense, isn't even necessary to get to that point though -- working the movement through a progressive ROM would also do the trick.

This isn't to detract from your points that strength and cardiovascular fitness are important, because you're right, they are important. But you can't neglect flexibility.

It even helps with the recovery process.
There have been a bunch of studies on this last point that have concluded that the benefit of stretching on the recovery process is negligible (if you're specifically referring to a reduction in DOMS).


I'm not going to push this any farther than that. So agree, disagree, whatever.
Respectfully, disagree. :good:

I'm definitely not against stretching though. I'm just saying that, for daily life and, more specifically, people advanced in their years, weight-training and cardiovascular exercise is more important overall. For many athletes, while flexibility remains a very important part of athletic performance, I think the benefits of stretching, in the conventional sense of the word, have been largely exaggerated. And, for martial artists, gymnasts, ballerinas, etc., I definitely do agree that stretching plays a much, much more crucial role and the focus on it is not unwarranted.