Inversion and double butterfly twists

[Alexx]

So i was just wondering, why is it people like to see a bit of inversion on double btwists nowadays? We all know a btwist is a full twisting butterfly kick and is never normally done less than horizontal, or it looks more like an A twist, so why is it in a double people like seeing them inverted ?

[Ewasiuk]

Because getting btwists perfectly horizontal is damn hard :dead:

[NinjaMuffin]

cos the ppl that say taht want to sound kl, like they can do it and every1 else is doing it wrong.

[TKD_Andy]

So i was just wondering, why is it people like to see a bit of inversion on double btwists nowadays? We all know a btwist is a full twisting butterfly kick and is never normally done less than horizontal, or it looks more like an A twist, so why is it in a double people like seeing them inverted ?

i think i have an explanation.

the classic btwist motion is hard to add *alot* of momentum to the twist without making it go bad, or rather its easier to add momentum if you make it more upright (hence you see alot of people who can just about do it, they'll most likely be more upright as it takes less effort / skill) but anyway, the upshot is that a double twist would be fucking hard to get absolutely perfect, thats why so few people have them (juji etc) so more people tend to make them more upright.

What does being being upright have anything to do with inverting them?

Its the opposite! although it *should* be harder to do it like an a-twist (i cant do both so im not defininte) because you have to do more of a rotation on an additional axis (aerial axis) so its more effort. However, if you do it like a btwist and invert it, you're basically stealing the feature of making the twist easier to execute (i've landed a double a-twist onto a mat, but have never come close to a double b). Personally i find that the spin on an inverted axis will be easier to modify to suit double twists than keeping on a horizontal btwist axis.

Whats the point of this ramble?

Summed up in a sentence: the inverted nature of a-twists makes them easier to chuck a twist, but if you use a btwist setup and only invert slightly you can make it easier to double twist.

[Alexx]

ahh i see what you mean.

i think a lot of people like seeing a little bit of inversion on doubles because it reassures them that the person doing it isn't trying to "cheat" it in a sense that it is more upright...

i also think nowadays people comment on double twists being inverted as a slightly lazy way of saying horizontal or a bit flatter and don't specifically mean head slightly lower than hips.

[TKD_Andy]

to be honest, if someone did a slightly inverted double btwist from a proper traditional btwist setups (i.e grants) i would be incredibly impressed, because i think it'd be fucking hard.

[Alexx]

mm i always think that it's cutting their height short though, if you could lift your head up enough you could get a high double which didn't invert.

i dunno where i'm going with this, just was curious why everyone appreciated these slightly inverted double btwists over the traditional huge wushu ones i guess ?

[Tocano]

My btwists are perfectly horizontal because I don't lift my head high enough. They look cool but swingthroughs are impossible. I think a useful tip is to throw your head up and KEEP it up. I throw it up, then pull it back down for the twist. That gives me a really fast twist, but I land with my chest too low. I need to figure out how to combine the fast twist with keeping my head up.

[daviddalo]

to be honest, if someone did a slightly inverted double btwist from a proper traditional btwist setups (i.e grants) i would be incredibly impressed, because i think it'd be fucking hard.


that totally sounds like fresh's double btwist in his new sampler :smile:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP_Vi4dEQhk

at 2:54

[mchitti]

I think ott inverts it more, his normal btwist has completely turned into an a twist.

and for me, I think dave c's double btwist looks cooler (which is generally hella fast and a little bit less than horizontal), maybe it's his hair.

[AdamSwaluk]

Fresh doesn't quite lift his upper body up, which would most likely help him become more horizontal AND give him added height.

[Skilzat85X]

The only people who actually invert their double B-twists are Ott and Fresh, and probably one more I'm sure I'm forgetting.

I'm pretty sure inversion being better is only relative to the performer, and that inverting or not inverted doesn't bear any secret technical value that will somehow revolutionize double b-twists forever haha, it's just a little idiosyncrasy.

Sorta like how there's a million thousand different little butterfly twist setups, but they all mostly do the same dang thang.


I don't think not lifting his upper body up will give him more height, btw. By leaving it in the same spot, that just means he's going to rotate around/at that height. If he leaves it there, it can't be boosted up anymore, blah blah blah. It's not gonna make him go up, however it's going to make his legs go over his head. It's usually of little consequence though really, oh well.

[Flowers]

It's just the exact opposite of a style of dub btwists (upright) that people tend to look down upon.

[poliver]

http://a579.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/1/l_2a2baa1fce29dacc00ba1c0547aca392.gif

i wonder if he has it now

[Flowers]

plus, inversion in my mind makes it an atwist

[mchitti]

plus, inversion in my mind makes it an atwist
not at all,
inverting a btwist doesn't make it atwist not matter how much you invert it, to a twist, you have to rotate on an extra axis, making it more flip like, and only a 540 degree spin (double)

[Flowers]

some people atwist like webster halfs, some people atwist like stalled wushu style. Somepeople atwist out of btwist setups.

This is not a good discussion to start hahahahha

[mchitti]

some people atwist like webster halfs, some people atwist like stalled wushu style. Somepeople atwist out of btwist setups.

This is not a good discussion to start hahahahha

true.

[TKD_Andy]

Fresh doesn't quite lift his upper body up, which would most likely help him become more horizontal AND give him added height.

haha i'd PM him and tell him he's doing it wrong then

[Skippy]

I think its bullshit myself, wushu athletes barely go actually horizontal themselves, and they were like, the original guys doing them =\ I think double b's should be a tiny little bit less than horizontal, or horizontal, but not inverted by any means.

some people atwist like webster halfs, some people atwist like stalled wushu style. Somepeople atwist out of btwist setups.

This is not a good discussion to start hahahahha

Better than half of your threads mr towels :]

[dpitlock]

booom

ecnx-V55xug

[Skilzat85X]

Dan Pitlocks is basically the only double b-twist we'll ever need ahaha.

[dpitlock]

boom

[Flowers]

I think twisting is important in double btwists...