Back Full and "Full Twist"

[WiKiD]

So there is a bit of a debate thats going around when it comes to why Cart Full twists or "Fools" as I call them are even called a Full Twist. I have heard from everyones tutorials on a cart-full its an arabian half or aerial twist off 2 feet. Now alot of people believe that since its A: not a backflip. And B: not 360 degrees that it's not a "full twist". Although alot of trickers who do a cart-full do fully invert, it's still not a back flip.

So here are the options, we can go on calling it what its not in that its a Full twist. Or we can change the name. So what side are you on? Is it a Full Twist or should we call it something new. And if so what?

[DarKoren]

hmm i can only roundoff full but you are right there are cartfulls that is just a cart-front-180!

[Ryan Murray]

Do we need to discuss this again? Really?

[Skippy]

They're front 180s if you're a spanner, K slash, Tkd_andy and Carney I have seen all do complete fulls in their cart full twists.

[Churoflip]

Those look like some sort of sideflip full to me

[Phil D]

Urgh here we go again

'We cant call a 540 a 540 because sometimes people don't rotate 540 degrees!'

[Kyle McLean]

Urgh here we go again

'We cant call a 540 a 540 because sometimes people don't rotate 540 degrees!'

people never rotate 540 degrees.



this is why i love dan perez, he taught me what real tricks are.

what ur talking about is two different tricks back full goes over the top. most of us dont do that. we do pop corks.

[WiKiD]

people never rotate 540 degrees.



this is why i love dan perez, he taught me what real tricks are.

what ur talking about is two different tricks back full goes over the top. most of us dont do that. we do pop corks.

Well then shouldnt it be, cart-pop cork and not cart-full? just asking.

[Kyle McLean]

Well then shouldnt it be, cart-pop cork and not cart-full? just asking.

yes it should.
me and him say that. no one else does.

[WiKiD]

yes it should.
me and him say that. no one else does.


THANK GOD, me and my buddy hate that it was called a full. Okay its Cart- pop cork. Kyle has decreed it so it must be!!!

[Phil D]

corks involve a competely different technique so i dont think you can really compare the two,i think cart atwist would be slightly more accurate haha

[WiKiD]

we should have the moderators vote on it, they know best right????

[Taimatsu]

yes it should.
me and him say that. no one else does.

C'mon man!

Me
Nick
pitlock

TKT isn't just reserved for SPECIAL 'ol you and dan!

[Kyle McLean]

corks involve a competely different technique so i dont think you can really compare the two,i think cart atwist would be slightly more accurate haha

i respectfully disagree.

[saunders]

pop atwist
almost sounds like 'popeye twist'

nahh i'll just stick with cartfull. that combo is so common it's almost its own move, like axe2aerial. trickers realise it's not a proper backfull, so why bother renaming it?

it's like the whole 'ma/tricker aerial' vs 'gymnast aerial' debate

[Kyle McLean]

pop atwist
almost sounds like 'popeye twist'

nahh i'll just stick with cartfull. that combo is so common it's almost its own move, like axe2aerial. trickers realise it's not a proper backfull, so why bother renaming it?

it's like the whole 'ma/tricker aerial' vs 'gymnast aerial' debate

for the same reason we need to rename the bs12. its not a 1260. its only a 900.

all of our tricks are named wrong. how can we ever get taken seriously with shit that makes no sense.

[Ambitrixterous]

There's much more than just 2 guys, if you look at what everyone is doing across the greater spectrum of tricking as a whole you'll see several different versions, all legitimate as far as our other tricks are concerned, all ranging anywhere from inverts to horizontals with 180 to 720 degrees that appear to us as "fulls, double fulls, corks, pop twists, arabian halfs..." and more.

Here's two easy general rules to follow:

-"full" is frequently used to refer to an invert that has been done with a full twist. This means that if it doesn't go upside down, calling it a 'full' will confuse someone!

-"twists" are a nickname given to any of our infinite horizontal tricks and their variations/styles/evolved forms. There are literally 4 separate positions to "pop twist" from that count as legit tricks.

When you're looking at people combining twists & fulls even out of something as simple as a cartwheel you have to look at the earlier move itself also. For example, a regular cartwheel leaves you in a stance in which your entry into a non-twisting flip could be counted as a sideflip (this is why people call them side fulls sometimes.) Or if you hit a straight gymnastic cartwheel you stand to enter your 'full' from the same position as regular back, BUT that doesn't mean you'll invert! The real masters of these moves will be able to enter from any position, and choose invert or horizontal as well as the number of spins & variations that stem from them.

-If it goes upside down, call it a full. If not, call it a pop twist, or pop cork, or whatever the hell you want it's not like anyone knows the difference anyway :tongue::ogre::dead::shocked::bandit::tongue::eh:: smile:



we should have the moderators vote on it, they know best right????

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH

[ShahrozS]

If we did proper gymnastics cartwheels they would be proper full twists :tongue:

[saunders]

for the same reason we need to rename the bs12. its not a 1260. its only a 900.

all of our tricks are named wrong. how can we ever get taken seriously with shit that makes no sense.

who do you want to take us seriously?
trickers all know how ridiculously stupid our current terminology system is, but most ppl accept it. when i trick with my mates it's not like we all go like:
"hey guise look i did a bs1260"
-"dude no that's called a 900"

or random bystanders who don't trick? they think our terminology is lame anyway, 'hypertwist', 'flashkick', 'masterswipe', 'doubleleg' all sounds gay anyway. plus they cant really count rotations anyway, so when we cut short they dont see it, even though it's wrong.

i can understand the current system bothers you though, especially if you are competing.

i really appreciate tkt, i look up to dan perez and admire him for all that he's done for the community, and i really want to learn more about tkt. but let's face it: the current system of terminology has been around for so long, and continues to grow on its old ways, so i dont think tkt will have such a big impact. a cheat900 will always be a cheat900, even though the name is not fully correct.

[Ambitrixterous]

If we did proper gymnastics cartwheels they would be proper full twists :tongue:

Nope. You can twist instead of flip from any position, if you want. Some people do it on accident tho haha

[Ambitrixterous]

who do you want to take us seriously?
trickers all know how ridiculously stupid our current terminology system is, but most ppl accept it. when i trick with my mates it's not like we all go like:
"hey guise look i did a bs1260"
-"dude no that's called a 900"

or random bystanders who don't trick? they think our terminology is lame anyway, 'hypertwist', 'flashkick', 'masterswipe', 'doubleleg' all sounds gay anyway. plus they cant really count rotations anyway, so when we cut short they dont see it, even though it's wrong.

i can understand the current system bothers you though, especially if you are competing.

i really appreciate tkt, i look up to dan perez and admire him for all that he's done for the community, and i really want to learn more about tkt. but let's face it: the current system of terminology has been around for so long, and continues to grow on its old ways, so i dont think tkt will have such a big impact. a cheat900 will always be a cheat900, even though the name is not fully correct.

Thanks mang but what Kyle & Me & lots of others are referring to is tricking becoming recognized as a legitimate sport. I spend a lot of time around other action sports guys- skaters, riders, free runners, and they are all cool just they always are turned off by the spin names cause they're not real. I always tell them what the kick really is, and the name some people call it, and why they do that and they always go "why don't they just call it the real thing, it would be more impressive" and I say "I know, I'm working on it." haha

But it's cool cause a lot of times I'll explain the kicks in TKT and sometimes those guys are more interested in the kicks then the flips & twists which amazes me because I think most trickers consider it standard that we're the only ones that care about kicking... I really think if we came clean with our spins we would appeal to a greater number of people but like you said that's not a likely change anytime soon :cool:

[Kyle McLean]

who do you want to take us seriously?
trickers all know how ridiculously stupid our current terminology system is, but most ppl accept it. when i trick with my mates it's not like we all go like:
"hey guise look i did a bs1260"
-"dude no that's called a 900"

or random bystanders who don't trick? they think our terminology is lame anyway, 'hypertwist', 'flashkick', 'masterswipe', 'doubleleg' all sounds gay anyway. plus they cant really count rotations anyway, so when we cut short they dont see it, even though it's wrong.

i can understand the current system bothers you though, especially if you are competing.

i really appreciate tkt, i look up to dan perez and admire him for all that he's done for the community, and i really want to learn more about tkt. but let's face it: the current system of terminology has been around for so long, and continues to grow on its old ways, so i dont think tkt will have such a big impact. a cheat900 will always be a cheat900, even though the name is not fully correct.

who do i want to take us seriously? maybe the x games? or sponsors? maybe someone willing to give us a shot, and throw some competitions that dont have chump change as prize money? maybe the media in general?

for some of us tricking isnt just a hobby.

i for one would like to do something with my tricks. not just fuck around in my front yard.

[sebben]

PREACH THE WORD!!!!!!

[saunders]

who do i want to take us seriously? maybe the x games? or sponsors? maybe someone willing to give us a shot, and throw some competitions that dont have chump change as prize money? maybe the media in general?

for some of us tricking isnt just a hobby.

i for one would like to do something with my tricks. not just fuck around in my front yard.

aight man i see where u coming from. but you seem so angry and hot tempered. at least that's how you come across.
no need for that, i just wanted to made my point and you made yours. i respect your view on this.
we all share the same passion, some more than others. for me tricking also isn't just a hobby, it's my lifestyle.

[ShahrozS]

I for one am tired of all the idiots going onto youtube videos of tricking and leaving BS comments like "he only did a 360 kick, wtf why are you calling it 540?" or even "all you fags can't count, he only spinned once"....Even on high level tricks like Gary's BS12 or Anis's Full-Xout-Full people will always come in and just comment on how the name is inaccurate...

[Ambitrixterous]

aight man i see where u coming from. but you seem so angry and hot tempered. at least that's how you come across.
no need for that, i just wanted to made my point and you made yours. i respect your view on this.
we all share the same passion, some more than others. for me tricking also isn't just a hobby, it's my lifestyle.

Yea just be like "relax papito!" lol

But it's true, we all share the same passion and I think where guys like Kyle & Nick & a few others take things so personally is the fact that they all work so hard to develop their skills and it's little things that hold us all back. Not you in particular, but conflicting ideas which revolve around the community as a whole taking action in regards to the development of the seriousness of our sport. A lot of people see these as unnecessary inconveniences, where guys like Kyle & Me & Danny & Pitlock & Durbin & Taimatsu & Nick Vail & hundreds of others see the opportunity to make a noticeable change with minimal effort.

But tricking will get big whether we want it to or not, it's the ones who keep an open mind who help to keep its integrity as it grows.

[Ambitrixterous]

I for one am tired of all the idiots going onto youtube videos of tricking and leaving BS comments like "he only did a 360 kick, wtf why are you calling it 540?" or even "all you fags can't count, he only spinned once"....Even on high level tricks like Gary's BS12 or Anis's Full-Xout-Full people will always come in and just comment on how the name is inaccurate...


Yeah there's two problems with that:

1. People who don't participate in sports that have twists are virtually UNABLE to count, regardless of the number of spins :tongue:

and 2. The ones who are actually calling us out are right. There really is no reason to call stuff something it's not, we have so many talented trickers out there hitting all the way up to a full 1080 spin with kicks which is about as big as anything gets.. we simply refuse to acknowledge the change we are able to make and it almost always gets dismissed as "well we've called it that for a long time, so who cares."


The answer is "not enough of us to fix it yet."

[Kyle McLean]

aight man i see where u coming from. but you seem so angry and hot tempered. at least that's how you come across.
no need for that, i just wanted to made my point and you made yours. i respect your view on this.
we all share the same passion, some more than others. for me tricking also isn't just a hobby, it's my lifestyle.

im not mad.

[poliver]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oucK8HRecRk 1:08 fulltwist? I say yes.

[Ambitrixterous]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oucK8HRecRk 1:08 fulltwist? I say yes.

That's the real deal there, boy. He did a 'tricker aerial,' which means nothing more than he entered into his full from a sideways stance (minus 90 spin) and went totally inverted for what would otherwise be 720back.

I'd call it something like "aerial pop double full"

[poliver]

I don't know about sideways stance, looks to me he turned back the way he came from threw his arms up and did a full(double). most fulls out of roundoff are done the same way, well except those that are delayed on purpose.

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1184/asdp.gif
Do you think it will be a pop full if this backflip was twisted?